(Tia is on for only the shortest of times.)
Russ: hi Tia.
(Tia says hello in Durondedunn.)
Russ: how goes it?
Tia: it goes well, it goes well
Russ: ahh, good.
Tia: okay, let’s get down to business.
Russ: go for it.
Tia: okay first of all let’s start off
with the news. Okay, Al Gore did know what he was
doing from the White House was wrong, just thought
he wouldn’t get caught. Hasn’t admitted that yet
however somebody did say that they drove him across
town so he could make campaign calls on another
occasion so he was aware that it was an illegal
move. Again the nuns and the monks in the Buddhist
temple, he knew that was a fundraiser. Okay,
Christmas has been canceled. Anyway, in a serious
note, let’s hand over to the next speaker.
(Kiri begins what she knew would
be a long dissertation.)
Kiri: okay dude.
Russ: what's up Kiri?
Kiri: okay, morals and coercion.
Russ: oh Lord.
Kiri: here we go. Morals and coercion
are very important due to the power of suggested
thought from the mind. The reason being that they
are so important is the harm that can be inflicted
on an individual by stray thoughts
of a coercer and the fact that this can lead to an
alteration in a person’s pathway and the life's
journey that the coercer takes responsibility for.
These actions have to be monitored very carefully
and stray thoughts from a coercer can cause problems
in such a way that it can be a continuing problem
not for just for one life but for many lives to come
so it is necessary to learn self-control above all
others. Having thoughts that interact with other
people and being able to manipulate other people is
a wonderful skill but misuse of this skill in itself
can present major problems. Necessary undertakings
of a coercer have to be done with a good and clear
conscience. The important ramifications of negative
actions of a coercer can lead to a self-destructive
pathway of the coercer and the coercee. The
responsibilities that a coercer takes upon herself
when she is coercing is something that the coercer
has to weigh with a good, clear conscience. I repeat
those words, with a good, clear conscience. Now
coercion in itself has many different types of
usages and each use has its own set of necessary
rules. Let us take everyday coercion which is the
most common that is used. What is right for the
individual and how to use a coercive beam to control
somebody else. Again, it has to be done with
a clear and good conscience, what is right? As has
been stated in the past, what is right for me may
not be right for you or whoever. But, coercion in
itself in the everyday mode is something that does
not cause too much problems because the situations
do not arise where serious damage can be done but
damage can be done and it should be looked at
carefully. If you want to coerce somebody to move
out of the way, come to you, to sit down, to be
quiet, these are all useful things of a personal
nature. When you have an express idea to coerce an
individual, that is where it becomes more serious
and in its serious nature itself lies problems that
a coercer may come into, a moral dilemma. Now there
are a whole load of morals that are necessary for a
coercer to live by. Doing the right thing, not just
the right thing for herself but, for everybody
involved. So when a coercer decides that she has to
coerce, it is necessary for her to weigh what she is
doing and to look at it necessarrally to come to a
compromise and in that compromise is the starting of
morals. Moral one, be prepared to compromise,
two, do not do it for self-gain. Self-gain has
certain clauses, self-gain and progression in one’s
occupation. For example, a coercer wishes to coerce
so that she can get a better position with more
fiscal gain so that she can provide for her
offspring and therefore improve their lives. This is
not a negative use of coercion but, using coercion
in a way that she gets a willing
partner who is easy to coerce to create a new life
within her, that in itself is negative coercion
because that is for self-gratification to continue a
lie. That is not done from love, that is done from
lust. Lust itself has to be addressed as a moral, it
has to be laid out and carefully analyzed. Lust is
an interfering factor that cannot be used in
coercion because that in itself leads to negative
actions. Once you start on that slippery path on
using lust to judge your moral standards, lusting
for wealth, lusting for somebody, lusting for a
contented, self-centered lifestyle, these are all
negative and should not be tried because again that
affects the long outcome, not just one life, but
many lifetimes. Okay, moral number three, purity of
heart. Nobody that I know has a 100% pure heart but
by using logic and understanding and reasoning,
something can become pure in your opinion. This is
important, your opinion is the opinion that you must
base your moral and coercive attempts upon. With the
pure mind that you perceive that you have, then
coercion becomes easier. Deciding and judging
whether something is right, whether something is of
good intent, whether something will benefit
somebody, these are all subcategories of purity in
coercion. Coercion in these functions serves as a
useful everyday tool but not everybody can be a good
coercer so if you’re in doubt, do not coerce. Now
specific subjects to coerce, people
of a destructive nature, I believe my
sister has covered in great detail people of a
destructive nature. But, using coercion
is a little bit like talk therapy and again it has
to be done very carefully and cautiously. You do not
replace one set of problems with another set of
problems or as my sister says, waveform patterns of
the brain. This is important to be understood that
when dealing with somebody of a destructive nature,
you must know when to say no and to disengage,
otherwise you will join them in their negative,
addictive behavior and therefore your own waveform
patterns in your brain will be changed. This will
lead to serious psychological and mental problems in
a coercer. When a coercer uses these new set of
destructive patterns that they have become addicted
to, they proceed down a very nasty, dark path where
the coercion becomes corrupted and festers within
the individual. Again there are certain morals when
you are using coercion for a psychoanalyst purpose.
One is, do not use it to start off with. This is
because when you are using it, first of all you have
to gain the person’s confidence naturally without
using any coercive skill whatsoever. Two, if the
person does not achieve your confidence or you
achieve their confidence, do not coerce them. Three,
having achieved their confidence, you coerce a
little, a tiny, tiny bit at first so that it becomes
a suggestive thought within their brain but not a
command. As you progress and deal with the problem,
now you can start to insert commands but these
commands must be thought out carefully.
is moral number four, think
out your coercive commands carefully. When you have
constructed the necessary framework upon which they
can build their improvements, now you step
back and watch your pupil or your patient develop
for themselves. That is moral number five, learn
when it is it appropriate to disengage in a healing
of a psychoanalyst nature. Having let them form new
structures on the framework that you have given
them, you can now start to help them to progress
into a more secure way of thinking. By constructing
extensions to the framework that you have created,
you have given them the opportunity to grow. That is
moral number six, aiding in growing what is
beneficial for them, not
for you but what is beneficial for them to progress
on their path and in their progression,
they will find that you are no longer a necessary
tool, that you are somebody that is now a friend.
That is rule number seven, letting go. When the time
is appropriate, let them go. Now following coercive
psychoanalysism, coercive healing which is normally
done in the presence of a healer. The
healer does the healing business and the coercer
opens up the mind to make it more receptive to be
able to aid in the healing. Aiding in the healing is
very important, it speeds up the process but it is
also necessary for the coercer to understand the
purposes and function of the healer. So we have a
moral here, moral dilemma. Is it appropriate for a
coercer to know anything about healing? Oh yes it
is, it is very important, that is why I’m not a
coercive healer is because I do not understand the
healing in my opinion well enough to be able to aid
in the healing process but a coercer that
knows nothing about healing can help to a certain
extent by soothing the person's consciousness and
subconsciousness and distracting them
whilst the healer goes about their business. Humor
in coercion. Coercion can be very
humorous actually, not many people realize that a
lot of fun can be had with good, positive coercion.
Practical jokes are something that coercer’s enjoy
tremendously and in doing so, you again have to be
careful of planting too deeply within the
subconscious a set of commands. These have to be
done very lightly on the surface but I do not
recommend that everybody goes around practicing
coercive pranks, that is for the more adept and
experienced coercers. I enjoy doing it myself quite
a bit actually but that is a hit moot point. But as
I was saying, coercion has a very useful tool in
humor. Being able to make somebody see that what
they have done is extremely silly by making them
look without themselves so that they
are seeing themselves from somebody else’s point of
view makes them realize that some of the things that
they have done are very silly and funny. When you
are coercing, regardless of whether it is comic
coercion, physical healing coercion, mental healing
coercion or everyday coercion, it is important to
remember that it has to be done for the best of all
parties or the individual that is being coerced.
for your own personal gratification but as I stated
there are the few exceptions. One is for
an improvement for yourself so that you can provide
better for your offspring or those that are
dependent upon you. Another one is if it is of a
destructive nature and the person could serve no
function from the learning experiences incurred by
that destructive nature. Three, another example is
where it becomes dangerous and the person is not
aware that their behavior has become dangerous
because they have not perceived that it is dangerous
but you have. It is your duty at that point to
coerce as a coercer them into a safe or an
environment that is no longer threatening for the
group or themselves if they are not aware or are not
suffering from psychological problems. Lot of if's,
and's, but's, or's in there but they’re all
important. Overall, coercion is a great tool but has
the power to corrupt if you do not think your
actions through carefully. Most people on the third
dimension do not have the speed of thought to be
able to analyze and realize what their actions are
going to achieve on the instant, they have to think
and plan accordingly in advance. There are simple
structures that can be put in as a tool for
coercion. First of all stop, think about what you
are going to do, think of all the possible outcomes.
These three things will help you decide if it is
right or wrong. Unfortunately you can’t make a
decision in a split-second, you can go on gut
feeling and instinct but sometimes gut
feeling and instinct is inaccurate. If
you’re ever in any doubt, do not…….I repeat, do
not…..I repeat, DO NOT coerce. You
have any questions?
Russ: one or two.
Russ: all right first off, when you’re
using negative coercion okay or for a negative
Russ: is the penalty that you accrue
through the use of that karmically equal to what the
negative coercion you are or do you get backlashed
Kiri: it is amplified, you get
backlashed a lot worse, it is amplified.
Russ: why is that?
Three: that is because you are sending
your negative energy that creates negative energy
from the person that it hits which is returned with
your negative energy and their negative energy and
anybody else’s negative energy that it interacts
Russ: okay. Third dimensional use, for
example as you stated when using it to acquire
Russ: you’re still incurring a karmic
debt there aren’t you or as I'll call it, karmic
Kiri: could you expand upon that
because what you’re saying is for personal gain, is
that personal gain only for let’s say myself?
Russ: let’s use the example you gave.
Russ: getting a better job so that you
can feed your children. Okay now, is that a karmic
debt that's accrued?
Russ: no? Not at all?
Kiri: not at all because you are in
actual fact paying a karmic debt, you are……because
you are involving your offspring, whether it is one
child or many children, you are therefore providing
for them so that they have a better chance to
advance and what you are doing is sacrificing a
little bit of your self for them so that they can
have a better environment. This makes it non-karmic
because you are doing it for the common good of your
Russ: well this is the first time
we’ve actually included children, usually it’s been
just you yourself getting financial
gain. If there is no children, wouldn't it be better
not to use it at all?
Kiri: it depends on the set of
circumstances. There are so many different variables
that could be interjected. We could sit here and
analyze this one in itself indefinitely. Let us say
you are the best person suited for that job.
Kiri: and that you see that with you
doing that particular function, you would improve
the people that you are working for,
would improve their lifestyles, you
would improve the growth of the organization you’re
working for and the overall group…..
Kiri: the people that are dependent
upon them. Again that is like having children, you
are sacrificing yourself for others, that makes it
Russ: I see.
Kiri: when it is specifically for your
own personal gain and your own gain alone so that
you can accrue vast financial gains, then it becomes
negative because it serves no other purpose than for
yourself. However, if it is part of a long-term plan
that by making yourself fiscally stable, that you
can settle down and find a bond mate who is willing
for you to sacrifice yourself to continue this
function so that they can raise the offspring or to
be taken care of by you, then you are involving somebody
that you are sacrificing for so that they can be
better off themselves.
Russ: I see. So essentially if we're
looking at it from a higher point of view, higher
dimensional point of view, we're actually the ones
who are going to judge us in the long run.
Russ: we’re going to be able to look
at it from the point of view after the fact when we
determine whether or not we did negatively or
Russ: so we’ll have all
these factors to add in at that point…
Russ: so at the time you just work
with your intuition.
Kiri: correct. It is something that
when you are dealing with something like advancement
within a organization, it is not now that you are
thinking about, it is later.
Russ: ahh, thank you. Okay, now for
when using it for healing purposes…..I’ll go onto
that section you covered….
Russ: in which you’re working with
patients or subjects, now the use of coercion will
tend to bond these people to you.
Kiri: okay first of all let’s
differentiate between mental healing and physical
Kiri: okay which one are you
Russ: physical healing.
Kiri: physical healing, I know very
little about physical coercion. That’s why I skipped
over it very lightly.
Russ: okay how about mental?
Kiri: mental yes, I know how to do
Russ: okay now won't these tend to
bond themselves to you?
Kiri: yes but as I explained that
knowing when to stop the coercion is important.
Being able to ease the person away from you is also
important and the necessary skills involved in that.
People will tend to see you as some wonderful person
and the normal thing to do is to
let them continue seeing you as a wonderful person
and when they find out that you are fallible and you
do make mistakes, then your image will be tarnished
and they may even be disgusted and turn around and
head straight back to their negative pathways. If it
is done carefully and in a particular way, for
example, let us say…..let us take a fictional
person. Say I heal somebody that has suicidal
Kiri: and they latch on to me. Now I
have to make them realize that I am not all
wonderful, that I’m not all good so I would do
things that would raise a question in their mind. I
would discuss with them and as I’m discussing with
them I would insert the thought that I am fallible,
that Kiri Tanaka makes mistakes. So therefore the
seed is planted for them to think that I am
fallible, that I am after all only Sirian and I do
make mistakes. Then I would deliberately make a
mistake, just a small one but I would wait a decent
interval of maybe a few hours or a few days and make
a mistake and they would see that I make mistakes
and that would make them think with the coercive
seed that is planted, it is like pouring water on
the seed that it would start to germinate and they
would still think I’m a good person but Kiri is
after all only Sirian and she does make mistakes.
Russ: uh-huh, okay…..
Kiri: but it has to be
thought out from beginning to end, from the start of
the mental healing to the end of the mental healing.
It has to be thought out bit by bit by bit.
Russ: alright, this takes
us to my last and most important question of them
all. In sixth dimensional, especially on Sirius……..
Russ: you have schools…..
Russ: that teach coercion……
Russ: that teach all the basics that
you just went over.
Russ: we don’t have anything like that
down here. Well, can we start something like that
down here if we're........like for
example if i put this on the web, this is going to
people all over the world.
Russ: well, how about people start
schools of coercion?
Kiri: yeah, it’s something that I
can’t interject. I cannot say what will work down
there, I only know what works on Sirius and what
worked in the past.
Kiri: so therefore I can’t say go
ahead create schools.
Russ: oh I know but I mean it would
seem to make the most logical sense that we put in a
theory into an actual hands-on……
Kiri: well there actually are a
search of educational facilities that do handle
coercion or rather they set up the morals to handle
coercion and these are religious, educational
facilities that teach good morals.
Unfortunately most of them are aimed towards making
priestesses and priests but these things can apply.
Kiri: that the morals of being pure of
heart and good and so on and thinking things through
are there already. It is just a matter of being able
to spread them and to be able to get everybody to
follow those positive thoughts and to achieve that
Russ: okay. That’s fine with me, it’s
just seems a little bit of a shaky institution to be
teaching coercion through, they don’t call it
Kiri: no they don’t.
Russ: and so you’re not really
learning the basics of how to deal with coercion.
Kiri: no you’re not but indirectly you
are because it teaches the moral structure. I will
admit I’m very playful, I enjoy making love
tremendously but I do have very strong morals. I
will not do anything that will harm anybody, that
would I think fall under thou shalt not kill. I will
not use coercion to cheat, I will not use coercion
to take somebody away from their bond mate,
shalt not covet thy neighbor’s husband. I will not
use coercion to cause destruction, thou shalt not
kill. I will not use coercion to get
somebody under my sway to do my bidding whatever
that is, thou shalt not steal. You see?
Russ: yeah, yeah, I understand that
it’s just we have those
same principles we learn in Sunday school.
Kiri: but it’s the principles that are
useful. You can take the 10 Commandments and use
them in a way that is a good moral tool on making
the correct decisions for coercion and by wording
them carefully and slightly differently, you can lay
down 10 laws of coercion. They are not suggestions,
they are things that you obey.
Russ: all right.
Kiri: you see?
Kiri: okay, any more questions?
Russ: no, that’s all I’ve got for
right now, I'll have to think about this.
Kiri: hmm, how long did that take?
That took up quite a bit didn’t it?
Russ: not that long.
Kiri: well we started that…..
Russ: about 15 minutes?
Kiri: uh-huh, yeah but it is basic
behavioral patterns that are important within
coercion. You see, coercion through the ages has
been used and abused.
Kiri: on our home planet, Tonar the Corrupt,
powerful coercer. Good example, great example. Tonar
the Magnificent, also a corrupt
coercer, that was after the ascension. (From the Sirian
Chronicles podcast.) Hurrah the Brave,
another corrupt coercer although he did try to
redeem himself, that is why he's called
Hurrah the Brave because he did great harm
in his youth but he started to understand the moral
dilemmas that he had created and the necessary plans
and actions. Actually he's a good example of what
was thought of as negative coercion to start with
turning out to be good in the long run.
Russ: uh-hmm. Yeah but where
is Honar the Brave here?
Russ: oh right.
Kiri: he’s been dead for quite a few
Russ: I mean that he could be reborn
and reborn and reborn.
Russ: he must’ve achieved some sort of
enlightenment from his turn of ways and he might be
on someone’s Council now for all we know.
Kiri: that is something that we would
not concern ourselves with because what he had done
in the past he had learned from.
Russ: correct but that’s what I mean,
he went through the necessary lessons so…..
Kiri: yes but at the time what he did
was that he had people constructing and cutting down
and clear cutting an area. Did great harm to the
land and he had an industrial complex and all the
yucky pollution that goes with that but, from the
research facilities and the things that
were related to that came out with good
things that were able to clear up the area that he
had destroyed, replant it and return it to back to
how it was. He had done great harm in his first 500
years and when he realized that he was heading on a
very negative path and all these people
that were in his control that did his bidding that
had no thought of anything else but to appease their
master, he started to change and to realize that he
had to redeem himself by doing things and restoring
the balance. What it had took him over
450 years to do he restored it in 200 and restored
the balance and also the technological
advances that came from his corrupt period in
agriculture, horticulture, all the necessary
interactions with that from that period in his life
in the long run became good. You see
they had to or he had to go through those steps to
achieve where he was going so it was looked upon to start
off with that he was doing great harm but, when he
decided to change radically and to advance towards a
specific goal that would be good, he had to make
some very hard and dangerous choices which made him
look very brave.
Kiri: hence the name that he got in
the last 350 years of his life, he didn’t live to be
900 because of how hard he pushed himself in the
last 350 years. He pushed himself very hard and his
actions were looked upon as very brave and long-reaching….
Kiri: and by taking those gambles and
putting in action a whole load of events that are
still even felt today. The
love for the land in that area is beyond belief.
Russ: I see, well thank you, that
makes a lot more sense.
Kiri: uh-huh, any more questions?
Kiri: you got questions but you just
want to get me out don’t you?
Russ: well I am a little concerned
Kiri: oh okay.
Russ: come back later if you want
Kiri: we’ll see.
(Tia returns to hand off
the channeling session to Omal.)
(Tia says hello in Durondeddunn.)
Russ: hi Tia.
Tia: hello, okay going to put on the
next important speaker.
Russ: all right.
(Omal finishes up the
Omal: greetings Russ.
Russ: greetings Omal, good to see you
Omal: yes, thank you. Okay, let us
look at Kiri’s dissertation. Long, very long. Very
informative, very eloquent and a little muddled in
patches but it works out nicely in the long run.
There is very little to edit apart from the little
bit of frivolous chitchat in the middle there. Okay,
Tia’s brief dissertation at the start or her stabs
at humor, she should not eavesdrop before channeling
sessions but that is Tia, that is her humor. Okay,
let us get down to business and address a new set of
topics, a new subject, development of the self. It
is a little step from what we have been dealing
which is self-love, self-loving morals, the benefits
of the group, this is now a discussion or a
dissertation on the individual and individual
growth, individual spiritual development. And in
looking at the development and the understanding and
the consciousness necessary to achieve growth is
something that is up to the individual. Is it right
to force as Kiri would put it, your point of view on
somebody? That is up to you, that is part of the
learning of self-growth, making that decision. We
cannot tell you it is right or wrong or I cannot.
is up to you to formulate for yourself if something
is right or wrong and in the growth that comes from
these internal debates and that is what they are,
internal debates, is the advancement. With the
interaction with other people, you grow, you learn,
you breathe, you live, you grow and growing is what
all my dissertations are about indirectly. They give
you a framework of patterns as Kiri said, a
framework to build upon and in doing so, the growth
that comes within yourself blooms into a flower
which can be seen externally. The confidence that
you walk, the weight in your voice, the appearance
of understanding, the appearance of people needing
to seek you out for your advice, this comes with
self-growth and self-understanding. And
with this understanding and growth, you can start to
affect other people. But growing for oneself is
important, to be conscious of how you interact and
develop and the love necessary for you to advance.
Are you awake Russ?
Russ: of course I’m awake.
Omal: you were breathing deeply.
Russ: oh that’s the cat.
Omal: ahhh yes, so it is. But growing
and taking care of yourself. Kiri talks about what
is right or wrong for the individual or the person
that is being manipulated but it is also important
first of all for yourself to grow and what is right
to help you grow. Set circumstances occur in your
life that challenge you and make you grow and the
growing is important, how you grow is up to you. As
I have stated many, many times, I can’t tell you how
to grow, how you should grow, why you should grow,
that is up for you to understand and
reason out. Do we have any questions?
Russ: yes when you mentioned about the
necessary love that is needed to grow from, you have
to achieve that through a long process of learning
how to love.
Omal: correct. It goes back to my
dissertation that I believe you have
just put on the Internet about self-love.
Russ: self-love correct.
Omal: and even though this is the next
step on and over, it does interact with my previous
dissertations that I have given in the past.
Omal: and in a way they interact with
the dissertations that Korton has given about
communication. If you were to put Korton’s
dissertations, his last two dissertations and my
last three dissertations together and put them side
by side, you would see that there are certain
patterns and structures that are formulated together
which set up necessary structures to be built upon.
Russ: okay, when you speak on the
growth and the love necessary, we’re actually
dealing with a question of strength aren’t we? I
mean it’s easier to not love almost and it
takes more strength I think to love everything than
it does to just be ambivalent or…..
Omal: yes ambivalent is a better way
to describe what you were thinking.
Omal: not to love suggests the
Russ: okay no, it’s just apathetic,
ambivalent, just you don’t care about things, you
just deal with them and relate to them in a way that
it’s just life.
Russ: that's the easy way out.
Omal: that is the easy way that
achieves nothing, you do not grow.
Russ: right, so you’re talking about
actually gaining an amount of strength as if you're
exercising your muscles. If
you go into the gym......
Omal: yes, in a simplified way yes.
Russ: okay, well that’s what I’m
trying to work with, so in a simplified way to let
people understand more of how
to take your lessons and how to apply them in their
Omal: correct. In a simplified way,
yes but it is a little bit more complicated than
just learning how to love, it is learning how to
interact, when not to love, when not to do
something, when to do something, why you do
something, why you do not do something. It is a set
of structures that are there to be built upon that
works for you. As has been stated, what may work for
me may not work for you. This should be
put down as a commandment but we do not give
commands. It would be a good idea to say this is a
suggestion for growth, what works for you may not
work for me.
Russ: so let’s say that you have a
person who’s just as we mentioned apathetic on life
in general who loves occasionally, like gets happy
about movies and certain events in his life and
things he reads the news and other times it’s the
other way, the other direction. Would it then be an
ideal way to do this is to start a regimen of….
Omal: no, no it would not and this is
when you see that something is wrong and
you set up a regimen, you are creating strict,
non-flexible pathways. There has to be times where
an individual hates something and at other times that
individual loves that same object that they hated.
It is a balancing act…..
SIDE ONE ENDS
(Omal gets back to the
discussion without missing a beat.)
how do we do that? Well it is through interaction
that we learn that an individual that neither hates
nor loves does not grow, we’ve stated that.
Omal: but, interacting gives you
experiences from day-to-day
things are different. Let us say we pick up a
inscribing object. We could pick it up many, many
different ways. We could pick it up by the point,
the end, the middle, the upper middle, the lower
middle, the middle middle and so on. We could pick
it up from the left, the right and again so on.
These are the same thing.........something
that you do repetitively but it is still interaction
in different ways and so by interacting in different
ways you grow.
Russ: hmm. Okay so if you approach a
situation, one which you're going to be
interacting in, is there perhaps then something to
remind yourself that when you go into this
situation, something that makes it more happier than
you would normally would be? Like just a
statement……not a statement but a…..just a reminder
like a Post-it note on your brain?
Omal: yes kind of, kind of but again
it is by pure interaction. Things change second by
second, minute by minute, hour by hour, day by day.
Things interact differently all the time due to the
density of the air, the lack of density, the
humidity, the temperature, the wind, all sorts of
factors interact upon an object or an individual.
The time of day, the time of night, the amount of
sleep, the amount of non-sleep, the part of the day,
whether it is beginning or end or so on
makes interaction different every time.
Russ: how about the strength of the
Omal: that waves and flows and ebbs
and grows and dissipates
as you pass through it as been stated
many, many times.
Russ: right so it does have an effect
Omal: and interaction is different
from moment to moment. Last
Russ: okay, so basically when we are
going to go through and put this into our lives
Russ: what we are doing is we are
shooting for growth so therefore when we enter into
interaction then, the best thing to remind oneself
Omal: do you want a yes or no answer
Russ: unless you have a dissertation
to go with it.
Omal: I could give a very long
Omal: but it would be too long at this
Omal: as I’ve stated, interaction and
growth vary from moment to moment.
This is an answer that cannot fully explain how it
works or why it works or how it should work but it
is the best answer I could give without going into a
detailed, long dissertation with no opportunity for
you to discuss it due to the fact that this is the
Omal: that is your answer.
Russ: thank you.
Omal: live long, prosper and I’ll be
(Tia's back and can spend some
time with me this time.)
(Tia says hello in Durondedunn.)
Russ: hi Tia.
Russ: I always like making those last
questions really good ones.
Tia: uh-huh and long as well. I could
almost picture Omal going…..
Tia: okay now it’s my turn. As ring
mistress I get to decide when I give my dissertation
or not but first of all let’s look at Omal’s
dissertation and analyze it and look at it and see
what can and cannot be put on the Internet.
Russ: now that you’ve gotten chewed
out for that one, where do we go to next?
Tia: I didn't get chewed out.
Russ: oh which, no I’m not going to go
Tia: what, my dress?
(A dress she had seen on someone who was part of a
Russ: yeah, yeah that’s it.
Tia: what about it? Okay, dissertation
on longing because this in itself, my dress, my
dream dress, the one that I want actually opens up a
very good moral topic and that is desire. Desire for
something that is a distraction, something that we
can’t have and the want and the lusting
for that object in itself can be destructive. The
things that you’ve pointed out are good examples of
looking at something and wanting it and pursuing it
to the point of everything else becomes irrelevant.
This is wrong, this is a wrongful behavior hon.
Russ: oh I know.
Tia: but it doesn’t change the matter,
we will deal with that and the fact that I’m in love
with the dress later on but what I’m saying is that
when a thought becomes all-consuming that you want
one item and do whatever it takes, it becomes a
destructive behavior. And if you do not think
out all the options that can occur and by planning
and working towards your objective to achieve that
goal but taking into consideration all the other
things that are interactive with that in itself,
then you turn a negative into a positive experience
on planning on how you’re going to get it, what is
the right way about going to get something, not just
seeing it and going, “okay, I’m going for it”. That
is wrongful behavior because you’re not thinking
clearly. When you think clearly and aim for a goal,
then you are thinking constructively like a good
thinking person. Any thing, any animal, that cat for
example, the feline, if it sees a piece of meat that
wants it will go for it. Anybody can do that, see
something and they go for it but if you think of how
you’re going to get it without jumping over
somebody, walking on somebody, whatever and how
you're going to get the person that has it to give
it to you, that’s where you turn a negative into a
positive because you're now thinking of something
that becomes beneficial for everybody involved. By
thinking things through and planning on, “the time
is not now, let’s wait, it’s not appropriate at this
time”, that in itself is a
beneficial thing. Any animal can go for something
straightaway, any animal can act on its instincts,
any animal can act on its hormones and chemicals but
what makes a person better than an animal…..and I’m
not putting animals down, I’m saying that
instinctual behavior and I’m differentiating about
it…..but something that is instinctual, a desire now
to have it straightaway in itself can be
destructive. But, by planning and scheming and
using your brain, you’re working that
brain out and by going about it in a way that is
beneficial is great. Any questions?
Russ: well yeah, a lot of times your
instincts are controlled by your body…
Russ: again, it's the same thing with
like potassium, all of a sudden you have an urge for
bananas you can’t understand but, "boy
that sure does look good".
Russ: I mean these are urges that best
are not controlled because your body often times
knows better than you are what it needs to maintain
Tia: yes but when you go, "okay I need
bananas, I need them right now", that is destructive
because you may be doing something that is very
important and that needs your whole entire attention
the thought of the bananas just pounding away at you
becomes a distraction. Controlling those urges,
controlling those thoughts is the important thing.
Putting them to one side and say, ”okay, I
will deal with that later at a more appropriate
time.” Hmmm......yeah but…..oh well never mind, I’ll
put on the next person.
Russ: all right.
(Karra's uses her channeling
time for a brainstorming session.)
Karra: how’s it
Russ: oh you’re
just full of good ideas tonight my sweetheart.
Karra: yes thank
you but Tia was actually quite correct when she
was talking about things being a distraction,
thoughts that are instinctual being distracted and
Karra: very well
thought out on her part I think.
Karra: okay, I
don’t have any dissertation or anything because
we’ve been doing a lot of work together over the
last few days.
Russ: yes we have
but very productive work, I’m taking a week off.
Russ: I’m not
going to touch anything on the webpage, I’ll think
Karra: oh no, no,
no, no, no.
Russ: okay but I
do have to make that change on your side, on your
section there to fix that coding error that’s got
it all blue.
Karra: how long
will it take?
Russ: 10 seconds…
Russ: well 15 if
I FTP it in.
Karra: okay so if
you change it, you will mark the time that you
finish and that your computer is switched off.
Let’s say you go in and you do it and it is 9:48
which I believe it is now correct?
Russ: 9:50 but
yeah, close enough.
Karra: okay, 9:50
on the 16th of September, 1997, you will not touch
the webpage. You can touch and play with your
computer for seven whole days.
Russ: right, so I
can't think about it either?
Russ: all right.
That’s tougher than actually working on it.
then let’s talk about something that's on our
minds right now.
Russ: you know
what that is.
or working on the development of some meta-psychic
University, school of thought, whatever…..
Russ: class I
don’t know but more involved with that because
there’s more to it.
Russ: well we
have a beautiful location up here, I’m sure we
could find an excellent place that we could hold
it in. People would come from all over the world
to come and study in such a place in a way that it
would be very harmonious with nature and yet lots
to do in the meantime when the evening time came.
talking for a second, I’ve got Tia’s talking as
well, she’s making a few comments.
Russ: okay, so
what you would do is you'd essentially get on the
web and you would invite speakers, teachers,
students and all to come to Lake Tahoe to some
place that you had set up. Part of that of course
would include a web kind of thing where you could
Spiritchat rooms on the web, involved in the same
kind of thing like teaching new age thought or
psychic skills over the web in a cyber classroom
you might say. Bringing in people for seminars,
sessions, basically having teachers from all of
the world, all of the galaxy, all of the universe.
Karra: yes, Tia’s
brought up some interesting problems.
Karra: ones that
I didn’t even think of. She goes, "what is the
long-term outcome?" And the ones that we’re
thinking of is the advancement of education, the
advancement of knowledge, the advancement of
Russ: well and
also the ability to start gathering groups…
Russ: together or
sending people out to begin groups.
brought up the topic of cults.
Russ: why would
that come up?
some people would perceive, she put it this way
that some people would perceive what you're try to
do as a cult-like behavior.
Russ: you mean
Jones or something?
something like that or the Heaven’s
Russ: well there
must be a way around that.
Karra: yes but it
is something that would be the biggest problem and
in doing so she said that there are things that
both you and Mark do not desire that would happen.
publicity and lack of privacy.
that’s just one thing but she brought up the
subject of cult leaders becoming not only figures
of joking ridicule but also figures in history,
figures that become religious figures and neither
of you two want that.
Russ: well there
is another option that is available......
Russ: is finding someone who’s already doing that
and assisting them.
example, remember that place that I read about
in…..where is it?
Karra: I remember
Russ: yet it was
in the Sedona thing.
Russ: Journal of
Emergence yeah and it was about somebody who is
doing something right there. It’s only like what?
Two hours away.
Russ: and they
have like seminars and classes and charge tons of
money for it but maybe doing maybe a seminar every
other month or so?
Russ: kind of
Russ: how it
would be not starting one yourself but at least
helping somebody who’s got one on.
Karra: if that
would be a better way to go but you have to be
very careful about cults. Tia brought up a very,
very valid point I feel.
Russ: well for
example those people, they aren't considered
cults, they're considered a retreat.
yes it would be a something that would be very,
would be better than the way that we were going.
It’s handy sometimes when we discuss things on the
intimate mode, we tend to overlook things....
Karra: and having
Tia as an external party and Tia’s way of thinking
which is different from any third dimensional
earthling that I know and any sixth dimensional
Sirian I know. She has a very unique way of
looking at things which is very useful and also
the fact that Tia sees things because of her
different perception in a very different way that
she reads people much, much better than you or I
Karra: and the
goal that we're going to is being able to pass out
the information. The Internet thing….
Karra: I believe
you’ve already got that in action with the chat
rooms and of course the Hades Base News.
Russ: yeah we’ve
got sort of the same thing going now.
Russ: and it’s
just it’s not as one-on-one as I’d like it to be.
Karra: no but
Russ: sort like
one on hundreds.
Karra: yeah but
even in a chat room or not in a chat room but in a
lecture room where people are discussing it is no
longer one-on-one. In fact it is far less then a
select number of individuals being invited to a
chat room to discuss with Kiri or Tia something
Russ: hmm, true,
Karra: and when
you have 15 or 20 people in a room, not only the
fact that we have to deal at that point with Tia’s
shyness and Kiri’s playfulness or showmanship, we
also have to deal with the fact that the anxiety
from the host.
Karra: he’s not
much in person on giving lectures in his physical
form and the fact that he would have to be under a
lot of stress and be expected to astral travel and
to let in somebody in an environment that he’s not
sure about, would be very stressful for him.
Russ: oh yeah in
an ideal situation, let’s say we’re in Sedona or
something, it might work.
Karra: uh-huh, in
an ideal situation.
Russ: I think
what we need to do is, do something that start up
various.......hook up with different groups maybe
on the net.
Karra: well and
Russ: well we do
that with the web…
Karra: uh-huh but
Russ: with the
Hades Base News.
Karra: but people
that don’t have access to the Internet. Most of
the people you know do have access through the
Internet but what about Johnny?
Russ: yeah true.
Karra: what about
Karra: what about
the groups down in Sedona that no longer have
contact with Omal?
Karra: see a
newsletter is the first step.
Russ: that’s a
good idea actually.
Russ: I guess we
could just take, take it right off the web,
publish the webpage maybe?
Karra: some of it
yes. One second……really…..I know that you have
newsletter publishing software don’t you?
Russ: oh yeah, I
did it for Heavenly.
apparently Tia just told me that Mark is getting a
graphic animation newsletter publishing set up.
Russ: is he now?
Russ: oh I could
certainly donate the article but we could like us
say just take it right off the web.
Karra: yeah, but
instead of taking the whole entire thing and just
printing it up off the web which would be maybe
once every three months you would have enough for
newsletter, you take let’s say a month’s
editorials and news and one dissertation and then
you would have from that your feelings on the
dissertation, Mark's feelings on the dissertation.
If people write in, you would have their letters
and our answers and maybe from Sedona because
that’s the market you would be aiming for it to
start off with….
Karra: you would,
we would go let’s say, "okay Omal said this but
let’s look at it from line-to-line and what we
think he is trying to say as Omal is known to use
analogies and imply things for our own
constructive educational learning" and how does it
apply and interact with a day-to-day. "Well on a
day-to-day basis it interacts what I have found
that it interacts this way, in my life." You see?
Karra: so you
take those items and you do it that way.
Russ: how many
pages would it be though?
Russ: and that's
front to back...hmm.
Karra: well no it
would be eight in total. There would be pictures,
a little cartoon section, something like a picture
of a person with an ax over their head, a computer
and the computer saying, “strike any key to
Karra: or a
picture of a skeleton lying next to a computer
saying, “congratulations, you have now logged on
Russ: you picked
that one out of there.
Karra: you were
where it came from.
Karra: but things
like that in a newsletter would be a useful tool
and you could put in also a discussion on astral
travel and all the problems that are involved.
There are many different possibilities that you
could come up with.
Russ: hmm, a top
Karra: a top 10
list of the most silliest world events.
Russ: top 10 ways
to tell if you’re astral projecting correctly.
should be getting pretty close to being over I’ve
just been informed.
Russ: all right.
Karra: you want
to check hon?
Russ: nope, you got
a long way.
Karra: a long
Russ: yep, a long
Karra: okay, so
you see there are so many different possibilities.
The university or college or whatever would be
something down the road, something that we work
Russ: maybe after
things go kind of worse for wear and cults aren't
even worried about.
Russ: I see what
Karra: yeah but
Tia did bring up a good point with that little
comment about cults.
Russ: right but
hey, it’s nice to get that out where it needs to
there is safety in numbers and right now, two is
not a number.
Russ: well not
unless you count the cats.
actually it’s a little more than two.
Russ: I know but
it’s still a minimal amount to what would be
necessary to have a viable community with growth
there’s somebody else for the newsletter, Skip.
Russ: how do we
advertise it? Through the……
that would be one way.
Karra: uh-huh. Okay, let’s get
the business expert in.
Karra: as Kiri
comes wandering back over. Okay, I will hop out
and we'll put the business expert back in.
Russ: all righty.
(Kiri returns to share her
expertise with us.)
Russ: hey Kiri.
Kiri: yo okay, okay now what are we
looking at? Okay business, business, business,
Russ: yep. So
we have printing costs, time involved….
Russ: mailing costs…
Kiri: uh-huh, okay.
Kiri: paper, ink.
Kiri: transportation costs.
Russ: what transportation costs?
Kiri: going to the post office which
during the summer wouldn’t be very much but let’s
say you’re stuck in traffic because of roadworks or
you’re stuck in snow?
Kiri: now, there is a way around that,
to cut down the costs down is advertising.
Russ: I'll agree.
Kiri: yeah, things that you could add
into it is cooking tips, healthy eating, how to
dress a dog properly.
Russ: put it in a little suit with a
Kiri: well I just thought
I’d get that in there because of Tia but we're
running short on tape time.
Russ: okay, what else?
Kiri: okay, now let’s look and break
it down bit by bit. Okay we’ve got cost of paper,
cost of printing, editing time, delivery time, mail
costs, ink costs. Now, as it grows, let’s say you
start off with maybe a mailing list of 10 people and
you do eight pages in total to start off with, but
you can add in in the letters section which can
either come in through the web and what you can do
is advertise it on the webpage and you can advertise
the webpage in the magazine or in the
Kiri: so you kill two birds
with one stone. With people advertising in it,
spiritual supplies, you
don’t stick to one topic. News from Hades Base is
the primary thing but you could have things from
Celtic organizations so that you appeal to a
larger group because marketing is the important
thing. When you market something, you have to unless
you want to be real selective, then you have to go
for a wider group. If you're doing a
newsletter and you want to reach as many people as
possible with as much information as possible, you
have to use other groups as well. And thinking about
it, it could be a useful tool to have a debate, an
ongoing debate with the Arcturians and the Peladians
and the Zeta’s in the newsletter, their forum which
means that you increase the number of people that
you’re going out to.
Kiri: now the interesting thing is,
the more copies you make, the lower the price is.
Kiri: let us say a year's subscription
and it costs a dollar a subscription and you do 12,
so that’s 12 of your dollars. Shipping
and handling let’s say make it 20 bucks a year but
that’s not going to cover you. So let’s say each
copy is $.25 so $.25 multiplied by 12,
right for a year? And then you would do.......well
that would be three bucks a year for signing up for
the newsletter and to receive it plus shipping and
handling which would bump it up.
Kiri: so people could order instead of
one copy two copies, each copy being an extra $.25.
Let us say that you're sending it to a store in
Kiri: and say it’s a popular
commodity, you could send it out it at bulk rate
which would be like three dollars which they would
pay plus $.25 for each one, let’s say you send a 100
Kiri: so that they would actually be
receiving........or they would be able to charge
what they wanted for it....
Kiri: whereas you would be
getting $.25 plus the three dollars shipping so that
would be $25.00 correct?
Kiri: which hopefully would cover the
cost of printing and so on and the tape is almost
Russ: we'll have to use our new
computer do that on.
Kiri: uh-huh, or use Mark's graphic
animation capable and he turns it into oh FYI file
and e-mails it to you.
THE TAPE ENDS