(Karra is the acting ring
mistress for tonight's session.)
Karra: letís get him properly
comfortable. Okay thereÖÖ
Karra: okay, so howís everybody doing?
Russ: excellent my dear, excellent.
Skip: great but getting better.
Russ: yourself my love?
Karra: thatís good Skip, Iím doing
okay, just a little busy.
Russ: well life is busy.
Karra: okay, seems like Iím acting
ring mistress for a little while.
Russ: oh what happened to Kiri?
Karra: sheís down with Tia at the
moment, Markís heading down there now.
Russ: whatís up with Tia, is not
feeling good still with all that work
Karra: I canít say.
Skip: she trying to keep up with
whatís going on?
Karra: they will have a linking down
there so that they can hear whatís going on up
here at this end.
Russ: any idea what I should do about
our disgruntled Hades Base News recipients?
Karra: how many more have we had?
Russ: just the one.
Karra: I think Markís idea was a good
one, get Tia to write personally a personal note.
Russ: thatís fine.
Karra: uh-huh, explaining whatís going
on, what Tiaís particular job is
and the importance of these announcements.
Russ: yeah I got two
people who said thank you and keep
Karra: uh-huh. Well thatís the idea,
you get one person that cancels and two people
that are very happy.
Karra: yeah, itís a choice.
Karra: yeah one person doesnít
want to face reality, there is a lot going on in
the world that is not nice right now......
Skip: yeah there sure is.
Karra: and the person that sent the
cancel in, theyíre not facing facts,
not ready to see what is actually happening.
Karra: my feeling is that if theyíre
not ready then theyíre better off not receiving
the updates and the newsletter.
Russ: yeah true.
Karra: and thatís the whole purpose of
the Hades Base News is to keep people informed and
be prepared for just such situations and
eventualities. The idea is to find
things that keep people ready and prepared, not a
constant perpetual state of readiness but of where
to make their own decisions on what is happening
and unfortunately compared to last year there is
a lot, lot more going on right now than there
was last year. Itís like the earthquakes this
morning in Turkey, there is a lot going on right
earthquakes in Turkey?
Skip: all over, all over.
Karra: I think it was a 5.3, Tia sent
me a kind of an e-mail, itís a
direct message. She sends me a copy of you get and
I get at about the same time you
Russ: hmm, I must have missed that one.
Karra: well the thing is
that Tia is working hard on these releases and
these releases are just brief synopsis'
what is going on. Just a brief little blurb
saying hostility in Chechnya, that they're within
15 miles of the capital and so on. I
mean sheís just giving the bare minimum
to you on whatís actually going on.
Karra: and sheís changing words in her
reports to make it sound like sheís picking it up
off the news services but she is not, she was
getting information which cannot be disclosed from
sources she cannot disclose.
Russ: well sheís using spellchecker
now so thatís good.
Russ: makes my job much easier.
Karra: actually sheís using dictation
Russ: oh, well
Karra: yeah, we finally got her,
because she has to think......Öshe
thinks in her own language in Durondedunn and then
translates it into English and to me she
translates it to Sirian and now she just
tells the computer to do that.
Russ: oh good.
Karra: I think in the one that she sent
that itís a beautiful planet and pull together as
a team and get these problems taken care ofÖ..I
canít remember exactly because I donít have it
right in front of me but her work is very, very
important. I donít think Omal would let her drive
herself as hard as she has been if it wasnít this
vitally crucial because it is all warnings for
Karra: itís a state of preparedness.
Russ: well like we said
on the page, it's the fact that hey, itís the next
step toward defcon one. Thereís
not going to be another upgrade from defcon two
unless it's just all hell breaks loose.
Russ: at that point too late.
Karra: pretty much so, itís just
saying that itís beyond hope at that point.
Russ: well the question Iíve got is
and I will ask Omal this but what is it that we
would take to go back down to defcon three?
Karra: a lot of the aggressive action
ceasing, a period without extreme seismic
activity, probably a general smoothness, not this
aggressive stance that is going on and itís not
just in one location, I donít think that wouldíve
been the deciding factor. I mean youíve got
different places, youíve got Peru, youíve got
Chechnya, youíve got East Timor, youíve got
Angola, youíve got South Africa, youíve got all
these places across the world where violence is
occurring. Youíve got the problems in Kosovo still
going on, the riots there. Itís not just a
localized, one-off place, itís all over. From a
healing standpoint there is a lot
of stuff that is very overwhelming that is very
aggressive and if you were to take all the numbers
from places like East Timor,
Chechnya, Peru, Colombia, all those places, you
would be running into tens of thousands of people
killed in hostile actions and then throw in on top
of that all the seismic activity of
people being killed in those and you're running
into hundreds of thousands.
running into a point where 50 years ago that would
have been unheard of. A 100,000 people killed
within the space of two months, that wouldíve been
totally unheard of. A 100 years ago that wouldíve
been very alarming. 500 years ago you would be
talking about 1% of the population of your planet.
So it's something that is very concerning as a
healer to see such harm being treated with such
triviality. Everybody goes, ďoh itís a shame, oh
itís a pity." Then you
look into the people that are suffering that are
still in reasonably one piece but mentally
suffering as well as some of them physically
suffering and youíre running
into close to a million people
and people just look
at that as numbers at that point. One is
regretful, a dozen is a tragedy, a thousand is a
great, great loss, any more than that and people
just donít comprehend it. Nobody can comprehend a
million people in suffering.
Russ: hmm, those numbers
are just beyond comprehension.
Skip: the numbers donít mean anything
anymore when they get up past a certain point.
Karra: exactly, everybody has seen a
thousand people in one place at one time or even
10,000 people in one place at one time, itís a lot
of people. Very few people have actually seen a
million in one place at one time.
Skip: yeah sure.
Karra: so it is something that is very
concerning and what is most concerning for me is
the fact that itís being treated as, "okay,
no biggie" which if Tia was present
and instead of just listening she would say
something about, "is one person worth any more
than a million?" And the fact that
people will go, "a
million people, 10,000 people, a hundred thousand
people", Iím pretty sure that Tia would say
something do with morals, the fact that the morals
of self-centeredness is causing many
problems which dovetails with what we were
discussing earlier Russ.
Karra: self-centeredness, using people
for their own means and ends. In fact you remember
last week about users?
Karra: thatís whatís going on here.
weíre using valuable time.
Russ: yeah, I'm all doneÖ.
Karra: actually Iím stalling a little
bit because Tia keeps on getting interrupted and
she is monitoring, monitoring us and monitoring
whatís going on. Okay, any more questions?
Skip: no, I donít think so.
Karra: okay, let me put on the first
Skip: okay darling.
on to help answer questions regarding land
Russ: greetings Treebeard.
Treebeard: greetings SkipÖÖ
Treebeard: greetings Russ.
Skip: how are you doing today?
Treebeard: I am doing of well and you?
Skip: fine but getting better.
Treebeard: I see humor in wording.
as we are filling and
backpedaling, let me instead of giving long
explanations let me be of available toing of
Russ: excellent. I have a real good
question, forest management.
Russ: the ability to monitor the use
of renewable resources like trees and using them
but not overusing them. How
do you establish a balance in a forest of
you use compared to what wonít kill off the
Treebeard: there is very easy of way,
you farm of trees. Remembering that it takes of
great time for trees to go from little sapling to
Treebeard: what you can do is take
area that is clear of trees and area next to it
being of lots of trees, you estimate how much area
will be needed for trees. You plant twice area.......size
of area for saplings which are of fast-growing
trees and you wait a while making price of timber
going up, then you start to of cut area
slowly for lumber, as
you are cutting, trees aren't growing. A five year
after planting first area you plant second area.
another five years being 10 years you cutÖÖyou are
about halfway through cutting area you have of
selected, you plant
area that you have cleared with little saplings so
you now being of having three areas. Then as area
being finished of cutting, you plant that area
with new of saplings so you now have four areas.
Time elapsed so far 20 years thereabouts of your
time. First area being just of ready to start
harvesting but best to wait another 10 years so
they are of 30 years. So having of reached 30
years, then you have area now where you have of
five groups of trees all at different phases and
you keep repeating project in a cycle. So
you have area of great size with trees that you
are cutting down and planting continually.
Russ: hmm, now donít the roots and the
stumps get in the way of your planting effort, do
you have to pull them out?
Treebeard: as they break
down, what do they be of giving?
Russ: I see.
Treebeard: so new feeding off of old
which is as it has always been with physical
Skip: in other words, youíre talking
about using a 10 year cycle.
Treebeard: much bigger than 10 years.
Skip: I mean for each planting.
Treebeard: each plantation.
Skip: yeah a 10 year cycle. 10, 20,
30, 40, 50, 60 years.
Treebeard: that being correct, 60 is
ideal number for trees to be of big size that
would being suitable for building of big houses
and long trees for tall rafters.
Skip: because right now we have a
cycle right here in South Lake of a 100 years on
Treebeard: a 100 would being perfect
but depending on speed of growing of trees.
Skip: you see because the
turn-of-the-century they clear cut this country
and then replanted it so thereís no trees over 100
years old here.
Treebeard: there are few groves where
there are memory trees.
Skip: yeah but from here clear to
Carson City it was clear cut.
Treebeard: which is very sad but area
this big it would being of ideal for
project of a 60 year cycle.
Russ: on Lake Tahoe?
Well there 70 miles of lake shore.
Skip: yeah and they clear cut it.
Russ: in how long a time?
Skip: probably in 15 years.
Skip: because there was not a tree
left up here at the turn-of-the-century.
Russ: thatís not good forest
Skip: no but see in them days they
didnít manage forests, they just clear cut.
Treebeard: well there
is being more to forest management then just
planting trees, you have to be of planting right
trees if you are using plantation style methods.
If you are of just replacing trees to restore to
natural, you do not plant trees that I am
seeing pictured in your minds. Those are wrong
trees for this region you are being of living in.
Those trees are being of non-drought resistant,
nonresistant to indigenous insect life which will
being of causing problems and also picture you are
generating suggests that of trees not being far
enough apart, too close together,
is part of the forest management.
Treebeard: also what is part of forest
management is natural for growth and being of
forest and of managers of forest not being human
but of being deva working hand-in-hand next to
forest deva is devas of fire. Fire is part of
natural process but if not allowed to work, then
fire devas lose control and skill of using fire
for keeping forests healthy.
Treebeard: with needle
forests, it becoming of problem that
acid increase in soil as needles being of
dissolving to ground.
Treebeard: okay next of question for
Skip: well then the Indians had the
right idea, Iím speaking of North American
Indians, they burnt their forest probably every 10
Treebeard: elaborate please.
Skip: either throughÖ..beforeÖÖokay
before the invasion of the European people into
the North American continent we had North American
Indians and their philosophy was to set fires in
the forests either by natural causes which are
lightning or by their own hand every 10 years to
burn off the underbrush and let the tall trees
grow and clean the forest.
Treebeard: ahh, you are being of
correct, that is part of natural process and good
management of forest.
I am interested in terminology you use, invasion?
We will discuss that at another time as I am being
of fascinated by what you are visualizing.
Skip: okay, okay at a different time
Treebeard: but you are being quite
correct in using that as example, that is healthy
Skip: uh-huh, about every
10 years. What was I was saying? Immigration of
people from all over the world to this country,
that has been ceased.
Treebeard: yes, I see it as potential
for great problem, great catastrophe.
Skip: uh-huh, I believe thatís why
weíre having such hellacious forest fires that
we're having now.
Treebeard: do not believe no, that is
very correct assumption.
Russ: weíve been
having some real bad ones
Skip: and theyíre getting worse,
theyíre getting worse, they ainít getting any
Treebeard: indigenous people that live
in forest or near forests know how to of being
managing. If you do not use fire as devas try to
do so, then you are taking away natural control
and fuel for wildland fires
increases so no longer being just scorching of
barn, it being coming of a holocaust, that is
correct word to of using?
Skip: yes it is, yes it is.
Skip: prime example is Yellowstone, what
was that, about five years ago or so?
Russ: eight years ago.
Skip: eight years ago? Now
everythingís all new, itís just beautiful there
Treebeard: but that is again example
of being so. But I think part of problem is of
fact that people are now dwelling within those
areas where once it was not a problem of being big
Treebeard: they were unseen and
unheard of but now people of living within those
areas see and being of alarmed and concerned of
Russ: yeah, the Indians were nomadic,
if they set the fire they just move on until the
fire went away and they could move
Skip: well true.
Russ: and nowadays, yeah you get set
up in a placeÖ..
Skip: well you got too
Skip: thatís the problem, weíre
Treebeard: yes, I am thinking of so.
Skip: and more and more people are
moving into the mountains to get away from the
cities so consequently they're overpopulating the
mountains where all the forests and all of
our resources are.
Treebeard: okay let us of
vocalize next question.
Russ: go ahead.
Skip: I have none.
Russ: oh, letís
see. Thatís a
good management plan for that, the other question
I have is concerning......is also with
forest management, the ability to
use proper farming techniques for agriculture in
letís say an area youíve already clear
cut of timber and now you want to put agriculture
in there. So youíre not going to grow trees again
but are you going to be taking away from the
health of the forest around you?
Treebeard: if it is isolated I do not
see problem but if you keep on expanding area and
increasing of size, then you are harming the
forestís natural balance. But if you keep it
isolated and small as initially set up then it is
not being of problem, they
are being like meadows.
Russ: oh right. Well many
times in our history we have.....and
present.....we have many areas that
are taking the forest, cutting them down to put in
agriculture and basically destroying forests
and itís finding that balance. The forest canít
tell you what its balance point isÖ..
Treebeard: true but if you listen and
look you can observe what is root cause of
Russ: hmm, well the overagriculturing
Treebeard: no there is root problem of
why you would need to cut down trees for more
Skip: more people.
Treebeard: so what is answer?
Skip: kill off half the people.
(Starts laughing.) No Iím just teasing Treebeard,
Iím just teasing.
Treebeard: I do see humor in your mind
in that but with what is going on
I think it would be not a idea of good to make
comments even in jest.
Skip: right, no the solution to this
would be a more efficient agricultural.
Treebeard: or learning
Treebeard: not abstinence but taking
precautions. Instead of two people having three or
more of children, just having one.
Skip: this is true too but itís still
to explode your population.
Skip: go ahead Iím sorry,
I didnít mean to interrupt you.
Treebeard: but I was just trying to
advise you that we are being listened to by Kiri
Skip: I was just teasing about
eliminating half the population.
Treebeard: I am understanding but I am
thinking of Tia with her
Skip: I know, I know, I justÖ..sense of
humor. Iím a little bit twisted but itís a sense
Treebeard: oh I am of understanding, I
am not admonishing you or anything,
I am just concerned that we do not want third blind?
Skip: yeah I know, I know. But no if
they would.....I believe in my own mind
if.....and theyíre trying to......agriculture
would be more efficient with what theyíve got
rather than trying to just expand land to grow
more food. Be more resourceful in growing two or
three foods on the land that theyíve got.
Treebeard: oh most certainly, it is
easy to be more efficient, increasing arable area
is just temporarily remedy to increase
in peoples. If you learn how to make area produce
much more and more efficiently, you can therefore
as you say two or three products in one year means
that it is more advantageous than just one. Three
being perfect set up for doing so.
Skip: I see this happening all over
though, where people
are getting more efficient with their property.
Even the cattle people are starting to grow
alfalfa in their pastures that
they can harvest while they're
still grazing cattle in
them. So there youíve got two products coming from
one piece of land.
Russ: well a lot of technology is now
with agriculture and have been focusing
on more higher yields with less space used. For
example, hydroponics, greenhouses, other various
means that allow you to control environments that
youíre growing in so you donít
have to use up necessary soil orÖ..
Skip: more and more and more land
Russ: yeah, growing in areas where you
canít grow. Taking a desert,
putting in a greenhouse or a very large set of
greenhouses even and you can grow as much in there
as you could on arable land.
Skip: yeah. See at one time there was
three states covered by wheat country.
Treebeard: now I should seeing that it
is of probably less.
Skip: see North Dakota, South Dakota
and Montana were all covered with wheat
country, Eastern Montana.
Russ: oh really?
Skip: that was all dry land wheat
country at one time, itís almost all gone.
Skip: because itís so arid. Now
they're growing other things there.
Treebeard: but Skip is of answering
your next question.
Russ: what to do with the land?
Treebeard: Skip started to answer
Skip: Iím sorry.
Treebeard: you started to answer,
please finish. You were talking
about dry farm, dry wheat and now farming other
Skip: uh-huh, yeah.
Skip: well, this is happening all over
though. Itís just Oklahoma, Texas and right down
through the mid-country was a dust bowl in what?
In Ď29, Ď30, Ď31, Ď32, the people all migrated to
California because it was good growing country. It
still is good growing country but
the populationís increasing so fast, they're
the wiping out the growing country.
Russ: hmm, well what are they growing
in those places now where it used to be
Skip: now itís going back to being
agricultural country again. Of course Texas and
Oklahoma is all oil wells but they stillÖ..theyíre
putting cattle and sheep back on the land which
they had pulled out. I would say in the last 20
years that areaís gone back to what
it was before the dust bowl ages. People done the
dust bowl, it was manís thing that done the dust
bowl. He plowed up everything so consequently when
the winds came it
blew away all the good soil. Am I correct
Treebeard: you are being of correct I
am assuming, I am not familiar with that period in
Russ: all I remember from that is from
Skip: okay what I understand is
European farmers came here and they done the same
kind of soil preparation that they done in Europe
which is to plow, disk and level and plant. Not
rotate or not.....what do they
call it? Cutting crossways the hills and not plow
everything, they plowed
everything. And when you turn the soil
continuously and make a flat land out of it, when
the wind comes it blows away all your nutrients
and all your good soil because you plowed the good
Russ: so what are they doing now, they
put up wind breaks?
Skip: oh thereís wind
breaks, they rotate crops, rotate planting, space
planting so that the wind can't blow away
everything and turn it into an arid land again.
Skip: but this was through a hard way
Treebeard: unfortunately soÖ.
Russ: still that's good
information for other people.
Skip: oh sure, sure.
Russ: especially things like say the project
weíre working onÖ..
Russ: thatís good information now for
agricultural planning in an area where
youíre going to be putting a dense amount of
Skip: yeah because you donít want to
level everything, you do and you lose it.
Russ: ohhh, excellent.
Skip: because if you level everything
and plow up all your soil holding properties like
your trees and your shrubs, if you plow up
everything and clear your land completely, the
wind will blow away everything you got.
Russ: hmm, interesting.
Skip: the wind is unforgiving.
Treebeard: you have moved away from my
field of expertise.
Skip: Iím sorry.
Treebeard: I am now of learning so I
am being of big eared to catch all that is of
Skip: Iím sorry.
Russ: well no actually thatís
very fascinating. It's just that for
example you plow letís say one way in one field?
Russ: and the field next to it you
plow perpendicular to it?
Skip: yes, yes and donít drag it
the same way, donít drag the two fields the same
way. What I mean by drag, let
me see if I can remember everything. When you drag
a field you level it, completely level it. You use
a drag which pulls away the roots and the fine
bits and pieces thatÖ..plants and so on and so
forth. You drag your field crossways to the wind
and you lose it all.
Skip: you drag it the way the wind
blows, you donít lose everything because it goes
down into the little grooves in the field.
Russ: I get it, I get it.
Skip: okay? If you drag
it crossways, everything blows off.
SIDE ONE ENDS